I'm sure we all realize that the various denominations that comprise the visible church each have their own reputations or stereotypes affixed to them (most of which are indeed earned). Oh, you had a vision from Jesus resulting in uncontrollable laughter? Don't tell me, you're a Pentecostal, right? So you think the locust-like creatures described in Revelation are Apache Helicopters? Which Calvary Chapel do you attend? That's a nice short-sleeved button down shirt and dark tie you're wearing, have you been a Baptist long?It's no different for us Reformed and Presbyterian types.
If there is a stereotypical "TR," he would probably be carrying around his two-volume set of Witsius's The Economy of the Covenants Between God and Man while debating with his friends about such hot-button topics as the distinction between elements and circumstances with respect to the regulative principle of worship, the priority of union to justification, and which translation is better: Beveridge or Battles.
In reaction to recognizing our stereotypes, we Reformed ministers are sometimes tempted to avoid overly-theological subject matter in our sermons ("I can't say that, everyone will roll their eyes and the visitors will leave!").
Enter Hebrews 5:11 - 6:3....
Having just preached this passage this morning, it really struck me how that, unlike Paul with the Corinthians, the writer of Hebrews simply refused to indulge his readers' spiritually infantile condition. The reason? Well, the nature of their struggle was such that it could be met with some serious theology (what the writer has been itching to explain, as the context shows, is Jesus' Melchizedekian high priesthood, but he knew they probably wouldn't get it, 5:6, 10; 6:20).
You see, of all the doctrines that he lists in 6:1-2 that represent the ABCs of the faith in which the Hebrews were stuck, not a single one of them is distinctly Christian. In other words, these topics, while important and fundamental, were all things that these Jewish believers grew up learning about (hence their hesitance to move beyond them and their familiarity). After all, unlike with pagan converts, if these Hebrews simply reverted back to Judaism it wouldn't be all that noticeable, would it? Which is why the idea was so tempting: "We can keep our same Scriptures, worship how we always have, and still retain the basics of this new religion without going overboard, thus avoiding persecution."
What the writer was trying to show them, therefore, was that knowing the Old Testament is not enough. I mean, the Pharisees who mocked Jesus as he died knew the OT, as did Saul of Tarsus and the scribes who participated in the martyrdom of Stephen. The real issue wasn't knowing or not knowing the OT, but whether or not you were willing to read it through the lens of the Tradition, the deposit of faith that the apostles were handing down. Sure, the OT Scriptures contained all the raw data needed to discover the gospel, but like a pile of bricks, it doesn't do much good until someone brandishes a trowel and some mortar and constructs the building. In other words, when the OT is called upon to bear witness to the apostolic tradition, all of a sudden Jesus ceases to be a Galilean who got executed on a trumped-up charge, and becomes a High Priest after the order of Melchizedek, in fulfillment of Psalms 2:7 and 110:4.
My point? Well, I guess it's that if you are facing real-life, grown-up type problems, then in order to deal with them you're going to need something more than "God Allows U-Turns" or "40 Days of Purpose." That kind of thing may suffice for a while (like Gerber's), but it will keep you in a state of perpetual adolescence.
In a word, when confronted with real problems, what you need is real theology.

Well said.
ReplyDeleteBut I don't know about the "pile of bricks" metaphor: doesn't that imply that the apostles constructed something out of the raw materials? I think "tour guide" works better: "Look, you numbskulls, that pile of bricks was a building all along. Let me show you..."
This was a wonderful post, and I agree with you whole heartedly.
ReplyDeleteHowever, I wonder why so many Reformed and Presbyterian preachers still give the Gerber's? For every good speaker I've heard in my Reformed experience the majority of sermons are usually things like, "Get in God's Limo" or "What are the Goliaths in Your Life." Some have been so bad as to include Spanish lessons, and the pastor admitting that he referred to some members in his congregation as "poor white trash." Others have cited their snow boarding accidents as examples during their sermons on suffering, and how God uses it for our good. One PCA minister ended his sermon (which actually sounded more like a speech for the Republican Convention) by slamming his bible shut and saying, "All right, that's enough of that!" The OPC church I used to attend even hesitated to use words like "Covenant" in a sermon, since they feared it would loose their listeners - (never mind the fact that the church had the word "Covenant" in its name!). But the worst i heard was when a preacher from the pulpit taught some blatantly bad theology regarding the Incarnation of Christ. I gave him the benefit of the doubt that he didn't actually mean what he really said, (i.e. Jesus emptied himself of all of his divinity when he became a man). He admitted that he didn't mean this as well, and apologized. But the true sad thing about it was before speaking to him, I had the displeasure of hearing one of our elders giving congratulations to the speaker for a "sermon well done." Neither was this mistake of theology ever corrected from the pulpit.
I know that these things happen all the time. I know that we as Reformed folk are not exempt from these things. But what i'm curious about is how this happens? I will bet that the majority of the ministers reading your blog will agree with what you wrote. So why is it that so many churches, even in the Reformed camp will still give us the Gerber? Why are there so many pastors and elders unwilling to put what you're saying into practice, even while agreeing with you? I'm not a minister. I'm not looking to go into the ministry either. I'm just a regular church going guy that truly struggles with this issue. Perhaps you can explain what I'm missing.
Jason says, In other words, these topics, while important and fundamental, were all things that these Jewish believers grew up learning about (hence their hesitance to move beyond them and their familiarity). After all, unlike with pagan converts, if these Hebrews simply reverted back to Judaism it wouldn't be all that noticeable, would it? Which is why the idea was so tempting: "We can keep our same Scriptures, worship how we always have, and still retain the basics of this new religion without going overboard, thus avoiding persecution."
ReplyDeleteWe see this played out in Acts 17. We are quick to applaud the Bereans because they “received the word with all willingness and examined the scriptures daily to determine whether these things were so,” yet Acts 17 opens with Paul spending three weeks with the Thessalonicans “discussing with them from the scriptures, expounding and demonstrating…” So, what’s the difference? Both groups of sincere Jews earnestly examined scriptures with Paul. The difference is that the Bereans “recieved the word with all willingness…” In other words, they were open to Paul’s teaching authority, as Jason summarized with his words "The real issue wasn't knowing or not knowing the OT, but whether or not you were willing to read it through the lens of the Tradition, the deposit of faith that the apostles were handing down."
Paige,
ReplyDeleteI don't know about the "pile of bricks" metaphor: doesn't that imply that the apostles constructed something out of the raw materials?
Well, I was trying to illustrate the difference between material and formal sufficiency (and not to be overly literal). So the OT had all the raw material needed, but it needed to be formed properly by the apostles so that it told the story it was always meant to tell.
Cyrus,
ReplyDeleteThat just makes me sick. Those guys who preach that way should be forced to redo their M.Div.s at Westminster Seminary California.
Brian,
ReplyDeleteSo are you saying that it was the Thessalonians, and not the Bereans, who were the real Sola Scripturists?!
Jason,
ReplyDeleteI'm still trying to figure out how Melchizedek fits into the 2K scheme, since he is simultaneously priest and king, as Jesus is homoousion man and god. The 2K scheme sounds more like a form of Sabellianism, where he has the mode of king and the mode of priest, and we understand Melchizedek in the same way that the Sabellianists see the trinity. The king and priest seem to be inseparable to me.
Here's one more related question that will help me. Let's say your whole church is flying to the south pacific to do a mission trip, and you are confident that everyone on the plane is a christian (so much as it is possible to be confident). On the long flight, the plane crashes and only the pilot dies but the other 200+ people survive and make it to a remote island. The island is so remote that no one will find you for 20yrs, (lets just assume that there's no way off the island), and the island has a limited amount of resources that will sustain everyone as long as its not intentionally destroyed. Here's the question: What kind of government would you establish?
Jason,
ReplyDeleteSo are you saying that it was the Thessalonians, and not the Bereans, who were the real Sola Scripturists?!
Well, now that you mention it...
Wyatt,
ReplyDeleteThanks for your comment, I'll respond in the morning.
JJS-
ReplyDeleteI was trying to illustrate the difference between material and formal sufficiency (and not to be overly literal). So the OT had all the raw material needed, but it needed to be formed properly by the apostles so that it told the story it was always meant to tell.
Right, that seemed to be what you were saying. But this would imply that the OT "material" was not already "formed properly," which is a little problematic (cf. Lk. 24:44f.; Heb. 1:1; 2 Tim. 3:15). Isn't it, rather, the hearers (or readers) whose mindsets needed to be "formed properly" by the apostolic teaching?
Jason wrote, "If there is a stereotypical "TR," he would probably be carrying around his two-volume set of Witsius's The Economy of the Covenants Between God and Man."
ReplyDeleteWitsius is not substantial enough for me. I prefer to carry around the entire three-volume set of Turretin's "Institutes of Elenctic Theology."
Wyatt,
ReplyDeleteI'm still trying to figure out how Melchizedek fits into the 2K scheme, since he is simultaneously priest and king, as Jesus is homoousion man and god. The 2K scheme sounds more like a form of Sabellianism, where he has the mode of king and the mode of priest, and we understand Melchizedek in the same way that the Sabellianists see the trinity. The king and priest seem to be inseparable to me.
Some believe Melchizedek is actually Shem (lots of rabbis hold this view, as does Scott Hahn), while others like Meredith Kline see him as a kind of local priest-king who presided over some local body of people who called on the Name of the Lord. Under Moses, the offices of priest and king were separated, with really bad things happening to a king who tried to usurp priestly powers (like Uziah and Saul). I think part of what made Hebrews’ announcement so striking (especially in the early part of ch. 5) that Jesus would be both a royal and priestly Messiah (as the quotes from Psa. 110 and 2:7 show).
Here's one more related question that will help me. Let's say your whole church is flying to the south pacific to do a mission trip, and you are confident that everyone on the plane is a christian (so much as it is possible to be confident). On the long flight, the plane crashes and only the pilot dies but the other 200+ people survive and make it to a remote island. The island is so remote that no one will find you for 20yrs, (lets just assume that there's no way off the island), and the island has a limited amount of resources that will sustain everyone as long as its not intentionally destroyed. Here's the question: What kind of government would you establish?
It depends on whether the Dharma Initiative is alive and thriving, or if they’ve been killed by Benjamin Linus as he seeks to protect the island from Charles Widmore.
I actually like societies organized from the bottom up, with each person having decision-making power only insofar as they are directly affected by the issue being decided. Complicated question, but I’m kind of an anarchist (!).
JJS,
ReplyDeleteI thought you'd say that Melchizedek is Jesus, since you went to Calvary Chapel. Calvin was firmly opposed to identifying Shem with Melchizedek in his Genesis Commentary, because Melchizedek had an unknown genealogy unlike Shem. My point rather, is that Jesus' priesthood is of Melchizedek (Ps 110:4), and therefore the role of the king and the priest are collapsed, which was David's desire to make a sacrifice via Ps 110:4. Saul lost the dynasty, and later Uriah became a leper. So I wonder how that fits with the two kingdoms scheme. Or if you think this is an invalid argument, I'd be interested why. Not trying to be a troll, just trying to figure this out.
I've never seen lost, I don't have time for TV. This is a serious question to me about 2kingdoms though. So do you recommend anarchy? or a feudal government? Or a random-walk government, that forms itself as necessary? In some regards, I feel like 2k works pragmatically in the US, because the government takes care of all the justice, and the church can wash its hands of it. people like the president or congress may decide what is ethical.
ReplyDeleteI guess I'm just not understanding the question.
ReplyDeleteThe two kingdoms model simply says that God governs all things by means of two distinct kingdoms, one civil and the other spiritual (this is what Calvin and all the Reformed theologians taught, with differing emphases, of course). There's nothing at stake 2K-wise by saying that Jesus is both a priest and a king even though Saul couldn't be.
Wyatt,
ReplyDeleteSo do you recommend anarchy? or a feudal government? Or a random-walk government, that forms itself as necessary?
I'm no political scientist, so I doubt I'd be the one making the recommendations. I prefer a form of government that, once all the proper nuances are stated, can be called libertarian, socialist, or anarchist (in fact, it could also be called "democracy"). But like I said, my training's in theology, so when it comes to this stuff I don't have the faintest idea what I'm talking about.
JJS, Do you agree with the way that Calvin divided church and government? I believe in his institutes, he said the only power the church had was to excommunicate a member.
ReplyDeleteNo, I think Calvin gave too many ecclesiastical duties to the city council, and vice versa. I think there's a difference between a theocrat and a theonomist, and Calvin was a bit too much of the former.
ReplyDeleteCalvin was in a hard place, he did write the institutes to King of Francis I, so I wonder how much of his views were a concession. Bruce Gordon's biography compared Calvin/Francis to Seneca/Nero. Seems like the church should have wisdom on what the government should do, since their both drinking from the same fountain of special revelation.
ReplyDeleteSo, I'm drifting away from my question. Basically, if Jesus is priest and king in a unified role, then shouldn't ministers likewise have civil/judicial functions?
ReplyDeleteياراعي الموقع وش قاعد تقول ومافي باللغه العربيهعشان نفهم؟
ReplyDelete